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Cordys 2nd July 2004 15:44

Is this Cordys stuff supported ???????
Is this stuff really supported ?. I mean, Baan has it's own middelware tools which are mature and cheap.

Johanblok 2nd July 2004 15:56

I heard that it's using private Baan interfaces

I heard that they use private Baan interfaces. This is definitely a big risk. What if Baan does change this interface ?. Your integration will fail!


W Rijsemus 13th July 2004 14:07

Compatibility risk
Hello Johan,

You are factually absolutely correct. We need to make a conversion from the XML-unaware Baan IV and iBaan ERP 5.0c to the W3C defined web standards of Cordys. Baan IV /iBaan ERP 5.0c was never built with Web Services in mind. Historically a lot of Bshell (portingsets) and AFS versions (Tools) have been built. We’ve made our connectors as standard as possible and usually only need to configure to the exact Bshell and AFS. Most of our Baan Installed Base customers are really good in the technical complexities of Baan and they understand – often in detail – the consequences.

Is it a big risk? I think not. It is a technical hurdle that any XML-unaware-Backend user faces and it is part of our core discussions during our presales, implementations and support.

Also, SSA Global would seriously hurt their own installed base if they would tamper with the primary functionality “contract” of core components like the Bshell and AFS. Effectively they would force their customers to upgrade to the latest Service Pack and Portingset. As every Baan user knows, that is not a decision to be taken lightly. Most Baan customers are lagging a few Service Packs or just install individual fixes. For most the old adagio goes: “If it ain’t broke, then don’t try to fix it”

Once you have unlocked the Baan ERP backend you can unleash Cordys at your heart’s desire. The future ERP Generation of SSA will be XML aware hence a standard XML plug-in will suffice.

Arend-Jan 14th July 2004 15:21

Hi Wilfried,

Your statements are not really correct. And Johan is right in my opinion. Most of your statements shows that you are not aware of the SSA products. Your statements reflects the status of ages ago.

"We need to make a conversion from the XML-unaware Baan IV and iBaan ERP 5.0c to the W3C defined web standards of Cordys"

Baan IV and other Baan releases are XML aware (via the OpenWorldX tools) and provide webservices on all releases. These webservices are generated using OpenWorld tools.

"Is it a big risk? I think not."

I think that it is a big risk. The Cordys product is using internal interfaces towards Baan. So, what if Baan changes such an interface ?. The Cordys product will fail and as a result the product does not work anymore.

"Also, SSA Global would seriously hurt their own installed base if they would tamper with the primary functionality “contract” of core components like the Bshell and AFS"

These core components do have public and published functionality. This will not change without any notice. The Cordys tools are for example using development tools from Baan. Only customers that bought development licenses can or may use this legally. But the Cordys product forces customers to use these development tools. This is stricly illegal.

Customers for the Cordys product are also faced with an extra server (Windows) that they need to install, while the SSA products can run completely on the server. The SSA OpenWorldX product can open your backend very easy. So, why should you bother and buy a product like Cordys that introduces a big risk.


Jeremy Williams 14th July 2004 16:52

What to choose ?

My company has acquired another company that runs JDEdwards. We want to integrate some pieces against our Baan4c system. Does this OpenWorldX toolkit also openup our JDE easily ?


sforest 14th July 2004 17:22

Hi Jeremy,

We are currently reviewing that OpenWorld toolkit for the same reason (We do not want to migrate to the Peoplesoft EnterpriseOne). My first feeling is positive, but I haven't seen al of it now.


vgobiraj 14th July 2004 18:36

OpenWorld is an EAI solution and it has adapters to different technologies(and some applications) like Java,COM,CORBA,HTTP/S,SOAP,XML ..and more

I have heard that JDEdwards has Java based interfaces so using OpenWorld Java Connector one must be able to easily integrate JDE and Baan

Email/PM me if u need more details

Jeremy Williams 15th July 2004 09:30

Hi vgobiraj,

Thanks! And this Cordis toolbox, do you know if that can integrate our JDE system ?


MarcoRossi 15th July 2004 16:00

We tried Cordys and the integration was working. Only we moved away since SSA made a clear statement that OpenWorld is the only official way to integrate and will be kept backward compatible and will support it. They are not supporting any other type of integration.

W Rijsemus 15th July 2004 16:19

Open visor and a handshake
Hello AJ,

I admit to your technical superiority. I am no match for that and you know it too. You have been a primary architect of Baan and SSA for a long time.
Most customers do not have OW. Hence my response on XML unawareness of the ERP backbone. Clearly OW(X) makes the ERP XML aware and more. In fact, we would love to use the WebServices of OWX but then they would be need to be commonly distributed to the installed base as the existing Baan4GL API’s.

Our words are, however - by definition - irrelevant. For that reason I will not be tempted into mobilizing those who were there at the very inception of B3/Baan EAI/OW etc. and chose to make Cordys BCP.

It is what the outside world thinks (customers/analyst) of the products. For that, I invite those to do as you would do when buying a car. Make a testdrive and compare. Ask the questions, fair and square. It always strikes me how knowledgeable our customers are and I have a deep respect for that.

So, back to the original question: Yes, Cordys is supported we are a 500 strong company with a solid footprint. We deliver a full Component Application Framework of which the EAI is only one component.

I guess this forum is also not the gremium to discuss matters that borderline to flat-out competitive accusations like "illegal". For the sake of our audience I'd like to keep our visors open and I know that you are also able to see the dead end of such a discussion. Courtrooms are filled with these topics. If you want to exchange views then we're open for that. Let us then do that in an appropriate channel, other than this.

I will admit to one flaw in my previous text: "Is it a risk? I think not". I should not have said that. It is irrelevant. Let the customers and world renowned analysts judge. Have a look at Gartner’s comparison of the Vendors. Go to their website and Search for Cordys and SSA Global in the EAI/APS arena. Ask our customers what they think of Cordys. In the end, that is all that counts. I've been at Baan and Cordys long enough to get a good grasp of that and also reap both the benefits and pains of it.

Sincere greetings and a professional handshake,

W Rijsemus 16th July 2004 09:14

Connect to JDE
Hello Jeremy,

Cordys has a generic toolbox which builds connections to ERP backbone. It is fair to say that we do not have a specific JDE connector. We've build standard connectors to Baan, SAP, PeopleSoft and Axapta and a number of customized connectors to other than ERP systems in the recent past.
The lead time to build a connector was deemed by our customers as acceptable. It does take some effort and also depends on how "rough edged" the application is.

MarcoRossi 16th July 2004 11:53

Hi Rijsmus,

We are planning to move to ERPLN. Is Cordys supporting that? I have heard that the architecture of ERPLN has changed to be better for integration. When are you going to support it?

W Rijsemus 16th July 2004 13:17

Hello Mr Rossi,

With the holidays, I need some time to give you a proper reply. I will be back.

W Rijsemus 16th July 2004 13:48

ERPLN-Support Con't
Ciao Signore Rossi,

With ERPLN I presume you mean the new ERP backbone that SSAGlobal is launching under their codename Gemini (ERP6.x).
I cannot speak for SSA Global but I know the new backbone is XML aware, be it with or without OpenWorldX.

Cordys can handle XML and technically you are indeed right that is a more friendly connection (agnostic) than Baan IV or iBaanERP 5.0c. So, we are capable of that.

Your question is however whether we support that:
We have 2 business tracks. Tailor Made and Standard. Tailor made is never a problem. For standard, in fact it is too early to tell. We do not have the intricate technical information nor a view of the potential business. As with any company that wants to do business we would need a favourable business case or at least an acceptable view of the investment and risks.

We would be happy to listen to your specific problem but that would then have to be taken out of this communication channel into our regular channel for which you are most welcome.

Con cordialy saluti

Johanblok 16th July 2004 16:55

Adapter for ERPln
Hi Mr Rossi,

I saw the new OpenWorldX Adapter for ERPln in a demonstration. It supports WebServices (SOAP) out of the box. There are standard Business Objects delivered with it was my understanding. From what I saw is it a high performance solution with great tools to model Business Objects. You can either model a Business Object on a table (via a special data access layer) and Baan sessions or DLL's. The Baan session modeler is great!. The consultant showed me complex sessions (like Sales Order Headers/Lines and related sessions).


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